Bullet Shape Vs Accuracy

[Curious]

Xterrettx,

Bullets for made for hunting are not the best to use for Silhouettes! They are made to fragment, or explode, which doesn't work for knocking over Rams in IHMSA. Just find two of the same weight, and work it out that way! As someone said, use bulk Remington, or Winchester bullets for Silhouette, and then buy a box or two of quality Hunting bullets, and load them for strictly hunting.

Using both the same load under each bullet shouldn't make any difference in accuarcy, and just follow the accuarcy steps I outlined in the above e-mail. You may have to adjust the seating die for different bullets, but everything else would reamin the same.

One last note, use only one brand of brass. You pick your own brand, again I chose Winchester because it seemed to last much longer than anything else! (I bought 1200 rounds in 1980, and I'm still using them with no falures todate!) But what really important is to stay with the one brand and eliminate any variables!

Doug

[xterrettx]

Thanks for the tips on case length.
I shot my loads this weekend and had some success and some failure. I learned a lot about crimping. I believe I need to buy a dedicated crimping die for consistence.
The loads I used were much flatter than the factory stuff which is great but, with out consistent crimping they where not consistent. Lessons were learned

The twist rate Ruger uses is wrong for long range accuarcy. They are a 1 in 18" if memory serves me correctly. Bob at Freedom Arms changed the twist rate to 1 in 22" to stabilize the bullets, he figured this out a long time ago.

I didn't know there was such a thing as "wrong" twist rate, only rates that worked best with different bullet weighs, also the SBH is 1 in 20"

Its disappointing to me to be told that a SBH wont cut it. I hope it will as its the only gun I have.
If anyone has any other tips on how to get the most out of there SBH let me know.

[Curious]

Xterrettx,

Over the first couple decades of IHMSA there was lots of research done about what made some revolvers shoot better. Many theories were expunged in the pages of the Silhouette, or IHMSA News. There was much discussion about throat diameters on cylinders vs. bore diameters, alignment of each cylinder being in line with the center line of the barrel, barrel cylinder gaps on each cylinder, bore diameter of the barrels, and of course the factory sights. Barrel twists, vs. bullet stabilization. I remember the even discussed a tool called the Revolva-gauge.

So is your question does a Timex watch keep time? Does a Rolex keep time? Or are you asking me which one is better? I think if you could afford one, I think you’d own the Rolex too. And I'm not judging your gun. Shot what you brought is a great idea! Nothing wrong with it at all. But.....

Ruger’s in most cases were found lacking in many articles on numerous fronts. Their sights were poorly designed for the rigors/requirements of IHMSA. Their cylinder throats were smaller than barrel diameters. Alignment from chamber to chamber was less accurate than others researched. Inconsistent barrel cylinder gap being another area found lacking. The 10 1/2” Ruger SBH is the Timex, which was designed as a hunting handgun that can perform decently in this sport. But the F.A. is a Rolex designed with long range accuracy in mind. I don’t think a Ruger has won the overall championship at the Intl’s in the last two decades.

Think about what can happen when any of the above discussed or research items comes into question. If your throat swages a bullet smaller than the barrel diameter, does it provide for good accuracy? How about barrel cylinder gap, doesn’t that effect velocity from shot to shot? Won't that effect tragectory? When you add a click of elevation/windage, does the actual impact point move accordingly?

Does a Ruger shoot well enough to compete in IHMSA? Yes, and with that statement in mind I can say that many state records fell to Ruger Super Blackhawks. Lot’s of 40x40’s in Revolver class have been shot with a Ruger. Much of that is by personal skill, and some luck. But there may well come a time when you find your skills out match your gun is all I am saying.

What I tried to tell you was simple. Your road to accuracy will start at the reloading bench. Eliminating all the possible variables at your loading bench would be the best place to start. IHMSA shooters share information readily. But only usually tell a part of the story.

I did say for years that I too shot a SBH. I found after a while that I was not getting the accuracy of out the sights I needed. I can honestly state is that I was shooting much more consistent scores after I started shooting the D/W’s in 44 Mag, or 357 SM. I can also say that the bullet flight was far more stable when spotting for those same brand guns over the next decade used by other shooters I spotted for. I could never put my finger on the answer to that phenomenon. Years later when I started spotting for a friend with the 1st F.A. 44 revolver in the state those bullets flew dead true! Until today I always thought it was the twist rate that was different. But I did my research today and found they both have the same advertised twist rate. 1" - 20" Go figure?

So to sum it up, I think Freedom Arms builds the Rolex of wheel-guns, and the attention to eliminating all those above mentioned variables makes for the extremely consistent accuracy everyone seems to be getting with one!

I will also state one reason I initially quit shooting the 44 Mag. For the .357 S.M. was the recoil was a bit too much. When I bought my new 44 F.A. back in the 1990’s, I went back to the drawing board and thought out the whole process again.

I went to Ballistic, an old DOS computer program, and found out what velocity would give me a 100% knockdown ratio. This ratio was figured out back when IHMSA used the full foot on rams. So I plugged in the bullet weight, the ballistic coefficient, and found that I almost everyone else was over driving the bullet. I had way more energy than was required with the full blown (H110-WW296) loads. That winter I then spent many days looking over reloading manuals for a full case charge of a powder that would drive my bullet at the approximate speed I wanted.

I eventually went outside the box, and settled on a couple different powders that might do the trick. After a lot of trips to the range, and lots of load testing that magic combination finally showed with a full case of AA1680, and I finally I had my desired load that has mild recoil, and deadly accurate, it also has a S.D. that is single digits. I get 10 shot groups that are a little over a 1” at 100 meters. It comes in at 102% knockdown ratio. And that was based on that old knockdown ratio too! So it works just fine.

I see in your last post you’re looking at flat shooting loads? That is not what is needed if your rounds are extremely consistent, sights repeat, or when you adjust them they move properly. So now I shoot with no worries about needing the right elbow pad, or have any worries about ligament damage. And now it really gets down to me doing my part, just worrying about my sight alignment to get those critters to lay down on command!

Tick, Tick, Tick! Ha! Ha! Best of luck!

Doug

[xterrettx]

So is your question does a Timex watch keep time? Does a Rolex keep time? Or are you asking me which one is better? I think if you could afford one, I think you’d own the Rolex too. And I'm not judging your gun. Shot what you brought is a great idea! Nothing wrong with it at all. But.....

Ruger’s in most cases were found lacking in many articles on numerous fronts. Their sights were poorly designed for the rigors/requirements of IHMSA. Their cylinder throats were smaller than barrel diameters. Alignment from chamber to chamber was less accurate than others researched. Inconsistent barrel cylinder gap being another area found lacking. The 10 1/2” Ruger SBH is the Timex, which was designed as a hunting handgun that can perform decently in this sport. But the F.A. is a Rolex designed with long range accuracy in mind. I don’t think a Ruger has won the overall championship at the Intl’s in the last two decades.

Yes a FA is better, I paid 300 for my gun an FA is 1500+ IT HAS TO BE BETTER. My question is how do I get the most out of my gun. To this question, you and several others have answered buy a better gun, that makes no sense.
I would love to own a FA, but probably not for a number of years (i'm in my early 20s with a new baby)
BTW the sights do suck, that upgrade is high on my list

[ole95]

here's my $0.02
I've killed 22 deer with a 44 mag most with a Ruger SBH and most with 240 SWC some with sierra 180 and some with Hornaday 240 xtp
I've never lost a deer with a pistol But I have never shot one over 50yrds. most I could see fall
it's all about shot placement DOUBLE LUNG 44 mag is a short range hunting gun
it's no big deal ring a ram but it is to ring a live deer!
the SWC like it's cuz the WC was designed for target shooting to cut a clean round hole in paper to make it easy to score. but if they were not accurate no matter how nice and round the hole was they would not shoot them.
I dare say they more SWC are cast for a 44 than round nose
I kinda think Mr. Kieth used them for both hunting and target
jrs