ihmsa forums

At the match this past weekend I ran into a bit of a dilemma & am not sure what the best way to have dealt with it is. Hopefully one of the members here could address the best way to have approached it.

I shot SB for the 1st time & everything went well getting me my best IHMSA score to date. I then went to shoot BB & my sighters were all spot on so I went to the Chickens table. I cleaned them but then some other guys came to the BB tables. They are older fellas & tend to pick one table & stay there for all 4 targets so instead of inconvincing them by asking them to move I decide to shoot all 4 targets from my table as well. There is only one small problem, the way the table sits I have to do a ½ situp & hold it while shooting. It wasn’t a problem for the chickens but after I cleaned the 1st bank of pigs I was really starting to feel it.
By the 2nd bank of pigs I was starting to noticeably tremble & missed the last 2 pigs. While I was happy to have gotten 18 hits in a row (longest streak yet) I was upset with myself because I was sure I should have been able to clean the pigs too. Here is when I started considering alternatives. I didn’t want to ask anyone to move but considered lying on the ground & shooting from there. Is this allowed?
I also considered pulling myself out of the rotation & taking a break & then going back to shooting but wasn’t sure if that would have been allowed. Sure my home club would have allowed me to do that but is it legal?
In the end I just gritted through it & my score reflected it.

I know I know, I need to start doing situp…

We never use tables. No one at our range does. Just throw a small rug on the concrete and there ya go. Heck, we drag the tables out of the way to clear a spot.
Plus, our tables are made to shoot from, sitting with a rifle. Not lay on top of.

Mike

My opinion would be as long as every person shooting would have the same option of shooting position, table vs. ground, then it is no problem. The only issue as far as rules would be if you gave only some shooters an option to change positions and not others. As far as withdrawing and continuing later, that would be a different matter. That would be considered a DNF if you withdraw. You are not allowed to disrupt the flow of a match. That being said, if something happened at my match and a shooter had to stop for a while (nature calls, etc) I would allow it as long as they could re-enter at some point and not disrupt the flow.

If the tables are designated shooting positions, then you should have said something. I've shot at matches where there is an advantage to shoot from one position, but the match had a designated shooting position and that's where you shot from. That way everyone gets the same chance on the targets.

I am one of those "older fellas" and as you know, I've shot at Crittenden for 24 years...but I wasn't there Sunday.

It's been done like that for many years, since attendance has gone done. Seems if there aren't a lot of folks shooting, we tend to just stay at one table and not move, IF you can see all the targets from one position. It's kind of been done partly for expediency, not like we're backed up or anything, but just to save a little time, and partly due to some laziness. There is no one table that is advantageous over others as far as shooting goes. Heck, I may have even been the one who started that...when you are the only one doing any work at the match, by the time I get done resetting and painting all the targets, all the other shooters have already moved to the new tables. It was easier for me to just leave my shooting gear at one table not being used instead of making all the other shooters wait even longer for me to switch positions.

When I was calling the line, I would ask each shooter if they wanted to move for the next bank when we were lightly attended. A lot of the time, they would stay put and shoot the next targets. Others chose to move. When we got busy, I made sure they moved each time to allow other shooters a chance to start correctly. I know some there, and Bob may know who I'm talking about, that just park their butt on the sighter table or some other one, and never move. The next shooters miss a couple relays because they thought they were in line behind someone else. This one is always a pain, in several ways, but I have to make him move. It's one thing when there are 3 shooters on the line, but when more show up, you have to use the correct tables.

You were at the BB chicken table. I know that table is angled oddly, due to the extreme downhill line of fire on that bank. I've shot all 4 banks of targets from that table many times, BUT, I am left-handed, so the table angle doesn't work against me...I can still see all 40 targets and engage them without a lot of difficulty. I can see where right-handed shooters are at a bigger disadvantage past the chickens from that table.

For those that say just move the tables and shoot from the concrete, this is why we can't do that.


If you look in front of the concrete shooting tables, you can see telephone pole sections that define the forward limit of the firing line. If one were to lay down between the tables, you would not be able to see any targets over the tops of those poles. Also, due to the downhill slope of the range, the elevated tables are necessary to be able to engage all the targets and still clear the ground with the bullet.

The best way to handle that situation is to ask the shooter to please move to the proper table, as you can not shoot all your targets from the one position. Laying on the ground would require you to shoot from outside the firing line, and you might not be able to see all the targets anyway. Doing more situps is not the answer. If the shooter is unwilling, let the match director know.

Sorry for the long-winded answer, but I hope it helped.

Dont go thinking I was irritated or anything, that wasnt the case. I was asked if I wanted to rotate positions & declined because it would have caused the duffers to move (yes Dean you're a duffer too ) & I didnt want to inconvenience them.

I have shot the whole match from other tables & didnt have a problem. Looking at Dean's pic you can see that the front of the Chickens bench is slightly higher than the rest of the benchs (farthest bench in the pic). That combined with my large ham hocks (I shoot semi dead frog) made it a challenge to get my head up high enough to see all the targets ergo the 1/2 situp the whole match.

I was looking for a loophole I guess. Next time I will just have to make it to the sighter table FIRST!

Make the duffers move...including me if I am there.

That is pretty much true Craig. The newer concrete tables are only marginally better than the original wooden ones we used.