New thoughts to build IHMSA

[Proclaim]

high standard 40,
Thanks for sharing with us the results to your inquiry. I believe what you found out will be true in a very high majority of the areas in the USA. We can, however learn a lot from your research and do what we can to keep IHMSA alive.
1) We can and must do a better job of communicating within the IHMSA ranks. This means from the president down and the shooters up, we can do a better job of 'advertising' our sport if we are all better informed.
2) We can and must come up with a 'marketing/advertising' plan that is implemented and utilized throughout the USA. Too many people, myself included up to three years ago, know very little if anything about our sport.
3) We can and must become better 'sportsmen/sportswomen'. This means that getting other people exposed to IHMSA becomes more important than my own personal 'need' to shoot my guns. Sportsmanship is more about the other person than it is about me 'getting my way'.
These three things in my honest opinion will keep IHMSA alive.

[high standard 40]

1) We can and must do a better job of communicating within the IHMSA ranks. This means from the president down and the shooters up, we can do a better job of 'advertising' our sport if we are all better informed.
2) We can and must come up with a 'marketing/advertising' plan that is implemented and utilized throughout the USA. Too many people, myself included up to three years ago, know very little if anything about our sport.
3) We can and must become better 'sportsmen/sportswomen'. This means that getting other people exposed to IHMSA becomes more important than my own personal 'need' to shoot my guns. Sportsmanship is more about the other person than it is about me 'getting my way'.
These three things in my honest opinion will keep IHMSA alive.

Very true. The people I refer to in my above post do unfortunately comprise the majority of today's shooters..........but they are not 100%. We need to find a way to reach those people that we can recruit, and they are out there, just not in great numbers. The single biggest hurdle we face is getting the word out to those people who have never heard of IHMSA. We also need to find a way to keep existing ranges open....this is another huge problem. It's kinda hard to recruit new shooters if there is no range to shoot at.

I will admit that I don't have the answers.

[LOCKHART]

At our range in New Braunfels, Texas, the land around it is very valuable
real estate. I can see that in the near future, we will probably have a
housing development put in behind us, and that will probably signal the
end. That was what put the range in Victoria out of business, a house
built behind the range was taking bullets, and quite regularly, I understand.
The bullets werent from silhouette shooters, just the regulars that visited
the range during the week. This is another situation that all our IHMSA
shooters have to contend with, also.

[Shaggy357]

$$$s and polical BS is what it is all about. Let's see, this is my year #28 shooting IHMSA....wow, that's a long time.....When I started, there were probably 50 people at my club shooting the matches....now there are like 9 at that same club...walk-ons welcome.

We don't have a video game knocking down steel animals....isn't a video game shooting a single shot handgun or rifle. All of the video games are shooting black weapons with multiple round magazines that you can drop and reload in seconds....I was at a local range here about a month ago. Over half of the people there asked me what type of guns I was shooting. I had my FA 357 and my XP-100 in 6BR. The didn't know what they were. They didn't know how I was able to flip golf balls around at 100 yards. 90+% of the guns being shot at the range that day were AR type .223s and black semi auto handguns in 9mm, 40, and 45 cal. Very few .22LR....no ammo around here...not a single hunting rifle that wasn't of the AR type...(scoped ARs were there).

Most of the ranges I have been around lately are catering to this crowd. These shooters are the ones throwing the almighty $$s into the ranges. They are the ones spending high dollars on weapons....why would S&W stop a production line to produce G2 Contenders or Encores when they cannot keep up with demand on black weapons?

IHMSA cannot tailor to the current buying crowd nor the current generation that is becoming adults. There is no video game support and there is no manufacturing support. IHMSA has to tailor to an almost extinct generation of hunters and shooters who still hold values that pre-date our modern technology; Folks with a gun cabinet that holds 5 or 6 hunting rifles, a shotgun, and several pistols. Grandfathers and grandmothers that have the kids and grand kids come over on weekends and let them shoot out in the pasture. Folks who come out to the gun ranges to target shoot, not blast ammo as fast as they can.

When I started shooting IHMSA, everyone stayed to the end of the match for shoot-offs. There was always a "rattle battle" or some fancy entry at the end to win a 50-50 pot split with the club. There were always awards, sometimes a meal, and always a guaranty of seeing your name in a write up in the IHMSA news the next time it came out. I have boxes of plaques, pins, trophies, awards, etc from local matches. I have t-shirts, hats, and even a few sweatshirts. Back then it was $30 or $35 a year membership. Cost about $5 per gun to shoot plus your cost of ammo.

Today it costs $50 for membership. $8-10 for entry per gun. Ammo will cost almost double to reload your own...triple if you have to buy it. I see hats, t-shirts, and sweatshirts at the big matches. Never see hardly anything at a local match....not even a patch like the old days. Write ups in the IHMSA news come out 2-3 months later, if they even show up in the paper. Rarely do you see a big push for state matches, regional matches, or even some of the other big events. Lots on Internationals....which seems to have become the IHMSA money pit......

So....what is the answer? How do we grow? Raise the price, right? Generate more revenue, right? WRONG!! Lower the price!! Lower the entrance fees. Give three entries for the price of two. Give out free entries to new folks. Get the stickers, pins, plaques, patches, etc available. Get some hats and T-shirts available thru IHMSA news. Get the scores and I mean ALL of the match scores in the paper. (People like to see their name in print!!) Make the Internationals a self-sustaining event!! There is no reason why we should spend more on Internationals than it generates in revenue!! Get more info on Facebook and other internet avenues......get the word out at the local clubs via news letters and internet resources....bring back the lower costs and the FUN we used to have.....

I know, I know, I KNOW!!! All the folks that have tried so hard for so long are burned out. I get it! So make Internationals self sustaining, market some products to generate revenue, get the word out on scores, lower the prices, and make it fun....make people WANT to shoot.....

My rant for the day.....

Steve

[Hosspower]

I would really love to see IHMSA built back to where it once was. I don't even know how big it was since my first match was yesterday at Tusco. I had a great time by the way and I will be returning. I also hope to enter a few more classes.

I believe IHMSA should remain a handgun competition. Personally I do not think adding rifle classes should even be on the table. Adding classes are pointless if nobody knows it is there. I found out about practical hunter by the print on the scrap of paper thrown in the envelope with my membership card. Current members have no interest so what good is it. It's like if you owned a restaurant. You see that you aren't selling meatloaf dinners. So instead of dropping meatloaf from the menu you add a meatloaf sandwich.

When I talk to other people about any competitive shooting the common response is: "there isn't anything around here." The truth is that there are shoots. People are not going out of their way to find these shoots. For local shoots word of mouth is usually how people find out about these. Sometimes a classified add in the newspaper.

For an international organization advertising is needed. A corner of a page in a magazine would be nice but would cost money. A commercial that would run on the outdoor or sportsmans channel would be nice but would cost money. Get a deal with a bullet manufacturer. You advertise me I will advertise you. That would cost money. I am not on facebook and have been refusing since it started and honestly for no good reason. I need to change that. I don't want to admit it but for at least the near future it is where you need to be to get the most visibility. People have to see that it is there. My late father was an IHMSA member since I believe 1977. He was part of putting in the now defunct IHMSA range in Jackson Center, PA. That is how I knew about IHMSA. Back when I would get on the Dan Wesson forum I would see the IHMSA patch in with a pistol pac or the ram silhouette etched onto a shroud. That's about it. If you want to know about IHMSA or be involved with it you have to search for it. On the Tusco rifle club facebook page 'IHMSA' is on there a grand total of 2 times. And its just the letters IHMSA.

Guys always talk of the friendships and stories from the range. One great things I found while searching IHMSA info was Bill Calfee and IHMSA80X80 chatting back and forth in open forum on world wide accuracy. I sat reading that like I was there with them. If either of you are on here those are great reads.

Please!!! Any gun club that has an IHMSA range please ask you members to promote the sport online. Show pictures or videos of people shooting. For that matter promote all types of matches that you organize. I can't imagine any club complaining about too many guys showing up

I have been reading these posts and there are 2 common themes that could be put to good use if linked together. I'm old and we need younger shooters. If any of you 'old guys' have kids or grand kids that are good with websites or looking at web design or programming as a career have them build a fan page. Send a link to all of the IHMSA clubs. By this forum we know that IHMSA members are online. If we could collectively work together to get this info in the right place I know it would help.

The thing is too cross interest circles. I'm into old Fords. If my Ford buddies online could see that I was into IHMSA some of them might click on a link to an IHMSA page. Out of that group you might get a guy or 2 that would want to try it.

The other topic is "people only want to shoot black guns." Total BS. While I was at Tusco yesterday I heard the SASS guys going nuts on the other range. Also I reload. I commonly see 41 mag & 44 mag bullets out of stock. I don't see black guns in these calibers.

Speaking of SASS checkout their facebook page. over 16,000 likes. IHMSA has 11 and no info.

A cool thing even for the IHMSA website would be a video of the rule book. The rules can be confusing when read. have video links for each section. Have video showing different shooting positions or sight categories. If any range has a college nearby check to see if they have film making. Students always need projects. And they are usually younger people.

Don't scare off people that are thinking about trying it. I read the recent newspaper article about IHMSA. Miss one shot and it's over. Very true for the international class. Shooters don't start off at the international level. You can miss a shot and it's not over. It's great there was an article but it starts off very intimidating.

I would like to bring some ideas to the main office but I thought I would throw some thing out here to see if anyone thought they were worth while.

To stay relevant you have to evolve with the times. In this case I truly believe it's information to the people. People still reload. People still use cast bullets. people still buy and own capable IHMSA guns. What is not there anymore are the magazine write ups. Look at the postal service. The information is not in the box at the road. It is online.

My name is Dave Edney. I plan on being at the July Tusco match if anyone would like to continue conversation.

[Curious]

IHMSA Membership history? This is ten years old now

How big were we? Here's the data it took me two-two and half years to compile!

Year End Total Count # of Life
1977 1336 64
1978 1517 77
1979 4662 150
1980 8140 206
1981 11510 253
1982 14312 304
1983 14961 345
1984 15189 370
1985 15184 394
1986 14281 415
1987 14190 433
1988 13010 454
1989 11814 465
1990 10369 488
1991 8949 496
1992 8101 517
1993 7857 542
1994 7413 552
1995 6826 564
1996 6509 589
1997 5538 598
1998 4929 603
1999 4458 608
2000 4057 611
2001 3852 615
2002 2791 617 (entries thru June 2001) This old manual logging system was discontinued.

Doug
Another past S/T of IHMSA
And I didn't date Tina "Boom Boom" Barlett! Too long a line? Ha! Ha!

P.S. I think everyone missed Al's point. IHMSA floats on it's sanction fees! Any extra revenue can only help! Who cares who makes it!
22 Ammo is scarce, components are spending, gas is high, so people shoot far less.
Early this year I had asked Lorene for a spreadsheet from QuickBooks since the date I put it together, but I never got it.
I would say that the numbers of entries have also declined "Drastically" pretty much on an annual basis.

Also, another idea is that we can also go back to the day and age of charitable donations to "IHMSA General Fund" ("Putting our money where are mouths are?")

One thing I've always felt hurt us, is there are too many categories, and not enough head to head friendly completion.
Once we lost the mandatory three entries per category to qualify for any championship match, things changed. Also the
demise of the Contender was a major factor!

Notes for the above: 1988 Elgin Died
1989 IHMSA moved to Iowa after the Intl's (Al's hometown)

[Hosspower]

Sounds good. I'm working on getting at least 1 big bore gun ready. I plan on being there all day Saturday.

[Proclaim]

IHMSA Membership history? This is ten years old now

How big were we? Here's the data it took me two-two and half years to compile!

Year End Total Count # of Life
1977 1336 64
1978 1517 77
1979 4662 150
1980 8140 206
1981 11510 253
1982 14312 304
1983 14961 345
1984 15189 370
1985 15184 394
1986 14281 415
1987 14190 433
1988 13010 454
1989 11814 465
1990 10369 488
1991 8949 496
1992 8101 517
1993 7857 542
1994 7413 552
1995 6826 564
1996 6509 589
1997 5538 598
1998 4929 603
1999 4458 608
2000 4057 611
2001 3852 615
2002 2791 617 (entries thru June 2001) This old manual logging system was discontinued.

This is VERY helpful information! It makes it pretty obvious that IHMSA started to 'die' a mere 10 years after it was formed in 1975. This doesn't 'fix' the problem, it does however give insight into the fact the IHMSA's decline to our current situation did NOT just happen in the past 5-10 years. It has been dying, in membership numbers, since 1985!!

[Hosspower]

I went back and read all of these posts again. I have a few more things to throw at the wall to see if they stick. There are a few reoccuring statements that could be addressed.

Younger shooters, travel distance & competitive guns.

Younger shooters:
You need to be 21 years old to purchase a handgun. Most young shooters will need to be brought to a match by a parent and will use the parents gun. I feel that more effort to attract new shooters should be put toward the over 21 age group. Then hopefully any potential new shooter will have a child that would also like to compete.

Travel distance: Target the market around ranges in operation. Much better chance of hooking the guy 30 minutes away vs. 2 hours.
Point 1: The 2 closest ranges to me are Tusco and Logan in OH. I checked both of their websites and without already knowing what IHMSA is and the match schedule I would have no idea silhouette shoots happen at these 2 clubs. Have some pics of a shoot, link to the IHMSA website, something.

Point 2: I have no idea how to implement this but my idea is a co-op between the gun range and local gun shops. Gun shops talk about or hand out a flier when they sell a gun for the particular type of competition the gun would fit. Gun ranges would need to educate the dealers about what they offer. Sell a ruger vaquero, encourage the purchaser to try a cowboy shoot. Sell a 6" GP100, encourage the purchaser to try field pistol at an IHMSA match. The club would get a shooter to the range and the gun shop might get the guy back to buy a ruger MKIII for small bore.

Competitive guns: This goes hand in hand with the point above. You don't 'need' a freedom arms revolver to shoot a match. To start out in IHMSA an out of the box GP100 is a legal entry. If you are a good shot and have accurate ammo then you have most of the battle accomplished.

One other point is on membership. Make people aware that you don't need to buy the $50 membership to try it out. Hopefully any that try it will then want to join. Focus on getting their feet wet then try to get the membership. IHMSA is fun for a lot of us. Getting someone to attend their second match is easy. The first one is the hard part.

[jmoore]

... Make people aware that you don't need to buy the $50 membership to try it out. Hopefully any that try it will then want to join. Focus on getting their feet wet then try to get the membership. IHMSA is fun for a lot of us. Getting someone to attend their second match is easy. The first one is the hard part.

That seems to be the hurdle that I've encountered. Folk are afraid of making their misses public. There is no "close", unlike most all other pistol and rifle competitions. As a field pistol junkie who insists on using cast bullets (and was just getting my feet wet again) I think I made it even more daunting for a friend of mine who was about a year delayed from witnessing his first match to actually participating.

Have I any answers? No! Done "layed out" of the sport for almost ten years meself. But happy to be back in!