Unlimited Guns & Stock Configuration Con't

[ihmsa53393]

I have not shot an IHMSA match for over 10 years because of petty bickering of the rules. It's no wonder membership is dwindling fast. Don't know why I keep up my membership.

I do shoot a NRA lever action or hunters pistol silhouette match every weekend here in Western Pa. with none of the problems IHMSA has.

[aggshooter]

I have not shot an IHMSA match for over 10 years because of petty bickering of the rules. It's no wonder membership is dwindling fast. Don't know why I keep up my membership.

I do shoot a NRA lever action or hunters pistol silhouette match every weekend here in Western Pa. with none of the problems IHMSA has.

I shot NRA Hunter pistol in PA, many years ago. A friend shoots NRA lever action in Kentucky and Tenn.. Both disciplines have rules regarding equipment, accessories, shooting position, sights, etc.

So my point blank question is this: in your NRA matches, are the rules followed by shooters and match directors? Or can a club simply disregard a rule in the pursuit of shooting better scores?

[aggshooter]

[quote=contender1121 post_id=20280 time=1599783525 user_id=6599
I don't have a dog in this hunt because I've had to give up big bore due to hearing issues and my small bore UAS gun does not have a concave forend. However, I'm still waiting for an explanation as to how the act of placing a seven pound gun (with a concave forend) across one's forearm is any less problematic than placing the same gun across an arched wrist. Unless you are a walking skeleton, the cusps of the concave shape will indent into one's arm and allow the underlying skin to come into contact with the arch. I've not yet seen a gun with a concave shape so pronounced that it would prevent contact. Even if it were too deep, the cusps are providing two widely spaced contact points on the forearm. In either case, such situations would be MORE stable than balancing the forend on an arched wrist because the skin will move with the side-to-side tilt of the gun.
Who out there can truthfully say they got beat out by a competitor, solely because their forearm had a concave shape? Can you prove it?
In my opinion this is a case of trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist. I agree, a rule is a rule but selective enforcement is not going to cut it.
I said in a previous post that the only real cure for the issue is to state that the bottom surface of all forends must be convex with a radius not to exceed (?) inches. Then what are you going to do when a disabled shooter comes along with a jacked up forearm/wrist that matches his convex forend?
So, what's the ultimate cure for this issue? Ban the flop position completely? I have a feeling that would thrill some people.
[/quote]

1. Any argument about how a gun fits your arm based on body fat is pointless and never ending. I have no intention of going there.

2. The whole point of this is to eliminate selective enforcement, and we can only do that by eliminating lax enforcement. It's not like we have a staffer who travels around the country to inspect guns at local matches. Match directors and knowledgeable shooters should be enforcing the rules, just as indicated when Doug described his first flop stock. The rule has been on the books for decades, it has been discussed numerous times and there are several articles in the IHMSA News dating back to 1985 regarding shooter attempts to circumvent the rule. The proliferation of the concave stocks is relatively new and mostly in the last 4 years.

3. The process for a grace period thru year end followed by enforcement was approved by the Board in a 6-1 vote. The Rules Chairman has been definitive in this. This rule has been enforced by all IHMSA Boards and most match directors throughout the years.

4. There is no conspiracy against the flop. From the start, Doug related that he and his wife both shoot flop, as do I upon occasion. Any references that this is a conspiracy, revenge, retaliation, butt hurt, sore loser, etc is BS.

[aggshooter]

So what is the bottom line here? We all admit that many local clubs allow guns that don't follow the rules and don't even check guns. Will these people who shoot local matches stay away from "formal" matches where guns are checked???? If these funny forends have been in use for years, isn't it time to change the rules to conform to the guns now being used??? Things change over the years and this may be one topic that may need updating. OR will there be one set of lax rules for local matches and one stricter set of rules for championship matches? I would guess there are more guns shot at local matches each year than at the WC.

Why would there be lax rules? I've been coming to your matches with the same gun for 15 years, one that has been vetted by both your guy (Harold Smart) and inspection at several world championships by knowledgeable IHMSA veterans. So sure, there doesn't seem to be a need to keep checking the same legal gun month after month.

I also understand that a new guy shows up with a "Specialty Pistols" bolt gun with a 16" barrel and you don't turn him away. I wouldn't either. You might even tell him he can shoot it all he wants, just pay the fee and bang away, but it doesn't count for score, trophy, or classification. And everyone is good with that. But you won't let him shoot it in your state championship and he understands that and is good with that.

So are you supporting that if a local MD allows that guy to shoot with a gun that doesn't meet our rules, or from a bipod that doesn't meet our position, that he should be allowed to use his bipod mounted gun with a 16" barrel in a championship match?

[260 Striker]

All good points but the number of state, regional and east/west formal matches have gone way down in recent years.
To me the formal rules still reflect thinking in the 80s and 90s. Sure we have added PH but even that was restricted with 6X scopes when in reality a hunter using a handgun will use all the optics available to bust prairie dogs way in the distance.
As shooting equipment and positions evolved (FLOP) the rules have not kept up with new changes. There are many people who don't see the need for rule changes. I personally submitted rules changes over the years and those suggestions just disappeared. Apparently only a select few are able to submit changes. I guess that is OK but when many shooters are now shooting "illegal" guns according to the rules, it might be time to look at the rules that are being broken to see if they are valid in the current IHMSA environment.
Not checking guns anymore is just a matter of local MDs lack of help or just letting shooters have fun with what they brought. We do not check your guns because we have known you for years and know you are very honest. If some stranger shows up at our matches we won't check their guns either since we give them the benefit of doubt about having a legal gun.
I see the need for rules but I also see the need for rules to meet current needs and not 20 or 30 years ago.
Either way I don't expect many shooters will chop up their forends to meet the rules. They will just shoot local matches and skip the formal matches.

[Roy 260]

Got a question how many member are there in region 4?